Leadership and Authority

May 29, 2000

"but be filled with the spirit... submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God."

I suppose even more time will be needed before we can really come to one accord on who we should be following, Jesus or man. There will always be those that feel that we should be following men because they are following the Lord but as for me, I will be content with following Jesus and humbly submitting to all of you who are also following Him and not to those who wish to elevate themselves above the rest of us. I ask no-one to follow me in this but only to point to my one Lord and Master, Jesus and to admonish you to consider the plurality of the collective leadership inherent in the body of Christ that comes with unity. Again, we should be submitting to one another. As brother Alan says, "The anointing on all of us, is greater than the anointing on any one of us!"

Of course, there will be those that will throw up their hands and despise this kind of thinking but we must go on. We have been down this road twice now and God is dealing with those who will not relinquish their crowns as well as strengthening us that are committed to Christian service. We are truly in the period of the first trumpet.

Revival is coming. By the way, if you are interested in seeing who the speakers are at the Celebrate Jesus Conference, you may find them at http://www.CelebrateJesus2000.com/speakers.htm.

As to responses, we had Brenda, who has been removed twice from churches for wanting Jesus to be the only leader. I know how she feels. Doug Fortune stands with us and thinks that Jesus should be the only boss. Tim Early believes that the dominion of the church is in ministry in that it is a collective rule. One at my outreach ministry had a dream that someone was on the podium asking all of us who were leaders to stand up. We all stood up. I guess if we are a collective that this is the true leadership and I can certainly submit to all of us in that but for anyone to stand out as separate from this is false leadership. Do you wish to be a Christian leader? Are you truly called to leadership? If so, it better be part of that collective unity and you better be serving us all in humility or you are just fooling yourself.

As to spiritual authority, God has given us the authority over spiritual wickedness in high places, we have the authority to cast out demons, to bring down the high places and bring down strongholds. We have the power to stretch out our hands and allow the blood of Jesus to course through our veins and out of our bodies in spiritual power to heal and to deliver and to fill others with His spirit. We have the authority to have signs and wonders following, God speaks and lives through us through the death of His Son and in the power of His Holy Spirit. This is true authority but as we have learned through this discussion, it is derived authority, not assumed.

There was an apostle that thinks that we should be under the authority of certain men because of the example given us when Nadab and Abihu rebelled against Aaron. Actually Aaron was the high priest and is a type of Christ. Who is your high priest? Is it Jesus? or do you put another in as high priest, like an apostle or a pastor like these people teach? I had a local pastor that wanted me under his leadership recently that thought that he was in a position of "headship" in the church. Those that follow this kind of leadership are the ones that are rebelling and serving God independently, those that follow Jesus are serving God completely. Why is it so hard for so many to see this?

How about some more confirmation in this, I am not alone but we should be able to come to one accord. Or should we go on. Our next topic is prophets. Should we submit to prophets, or should they be subject to one another. Of course the latter is true but what of authority. The only authority that prophets have is the God that speaks through them. I have heard many prophets tell me that I MUST listen to them because they hear the Lord. As far as I am concerned, they are also serving God independently, again, we must submit to each other - that is what love, humility and dialogue is all about.


Greetings Jay in the name of Jesus the Christ,

This is the first time I have taken the opportunity to respond. I thank God so much for what God has imparted into you. Thank you for allowing God to use you in this manner. I have truly appreciated and be enlighten as I have read all these emails.

Be a young lady in the ministry is such a Blessing, along with the suffering. I have and will continue to be a servant of the most high God, sharing with all those believers and no-believers that it is not me, but Jesus the Christ that lives in me.

I have been put out of 2 churches, because I stood on the truth that Jesus was the only leader. It is so sad to see the people that is yet in bondage, due to pastors making them feel as though they are God.

May God continue to use you as a vessel unto honor, to help people like myself and others.

I stand on this scripture. 2 Corin 13:8
God is Truth!!!!

Your sister in Christ Jesus

Evang Todd, (Brenda)

Sent by blackvoices Mail

by Doug Fortune

This is not intended to be a deep and thorough Biblical study, just some practical thoughts to share. OK, so now we have apostles and prophets in the Church along with the pastors we've always had... so who's the boss? If that is my main concern, then I have totally missed the heart of the apostolic reformation. Is the restoration of apostles in the church intended to give us another hierarchy system with a bit more impressive titles?... Apostle so and so, sounds pretty lofty! In fact, I Cor.12:28 tells us that it's "...apostles FIRST...", so that makes them the boss, right?... NOT! The word translated FIRST, is 'proton' in Greek; it is the neuter form of protos; so firstly we see that there is no gender designation concerning apostles... remember, in Christ there is neither male nor female. Proton means, 'firstly in time, place, order or importance; before, at the beginning'. I believe this significant, as apostles are referred to as the foundation (Christ being the Cornerstone), and the foundation comes before the rest of the house is built. I believe it also refers to a 'pioneering' spirit, one who blazes a trail for others. Does this mean that the apostle is the boss?... no, it means that there is a spiritual grace upon them for their particular task.

The key in the authority issue is simply recognizing the gifting and ministry of Christ operating through each other, recognizing FUNCTIONAL responsibility, and then 'submitting to each other in love'. How can I be 'boss' of something that I have no functional responsibility and no gifting for? My wife is extremely gifted in the kitchen (the extra five pounds I carry around my waist is proof!) and she bears the primary FUNCTIONAL responsibility of feeding our family of six. Now the husband is the head of the wife, right?... so that means I'm the boss of the kitchen, right?... NOT!!! I gladly submit to her authority in the kitchen until such time I am willing to take the FUNCTIONAL responsibility of feeding our growing army (that will NEVER happen!).

Now we understand this principle this in a household matter like the kitchen, but why do we often times fail to get it in the Household of Faith? How many people with a servant's heart have been trampled upon because someone in supposed authority who had never performed the particular task thought it ought to be done their way? I am the worship leader for our worship team in our fellowship, however I am not particularly gifted in administration (that's an understatement!). Our keyboard player (who is a worship leader also) is wonderfully gifted in administration, so she takes care of any administration and I gladly submit to her authority.... nobody is worried about who's the boss! I believe that at the root of many of the problems we have in the Church in this area is that unfortunately many of our ideas of authority are based on a religious Babylonian clergy / laity hierarchy system rather than Kingdom principles. What feeds this also is the SOULISH desire to be in control. I'm NOT saying we shouldn't be good managers of the resources that God gives us, but good management is building Christ IN the people. Recognizing and nurturing the gifting and ministry of Christ through others IS building Christ in them AND good management. This is the strength of the apostle... the ability to speak words that are containers of Life and Light into the life of an individual and thereby release or activate the anointing already resident, but previously dormant in the individual.

Should this be any kind of a threat to the pastor (I use this term pastor to mean the primary leader in a church, not because that is an accurate description of a pastor, but because that is what the religious system calls them) that the apostle can do something that the pastor probably isn't gifted for?... not if the pastor has a true shepherd's heart. Does this make the apostle superior to the pastor?... no, just a different gifting and function. Does this give the apostle greater authority with the people than the pastor has?... no, because the FUNCTIONAL responsibility of caring for the sheep ultimately lies with the pastor... but part of effective pastoring IS helping provide others with apostolic influence (as well as all the other five fold ministries). If my objective is to build up MY ministry or build up MY fellowship, then I am probably operating under a Babylonian hierarchy mentality. If my objective is to undergird and support and build Christ INTO the people, then I must operate under the Kingdom principle of recognizing the ministry of Christ through other five fold ministers, many of whom are currently sitting in the congregation and not paid staff members necessarily. Let's let Christ build up HIS Church.

Back to the authority issue... I believe it is a fairly accurate rule of thumb in determining authority that we first determine FUNCTIONAL responsibility... whoever is actually responsible for seeing that the task gets done (that doesn't mean they are doing ALL the work by themself) is probably the best candidate for having the authority in that area. For example, should the pastor or senior elder (whatever you choose to call them) choose all the songs for the worship leader?... probably no more than the worship leader should write the pastors sermon. Should the worship leader determine the length of time for music in a service?... no, because the ultimate functional responsibility for a service usually lies with the pastor. Most of the time, just some sanctified common sense can solve potential problems.

Another result of the religious clergy / laity system is the idea that I must have some person as my 'spiritual head'. I believe that Christ is the HEAD whom I am to grow up into (Eph.4:15); and what of I Tim.2:5 as it says "...there is one God and ONE MEDIATOR between God and man, the MAN Christ Jesus."... we are ALL individual priests before God. Yes, we all need accountability relationships.. yes, we must submit ourselves one to another; however, if someone insists that you submit to them outside the areas of their FUNCTIONAL responsibility, then I say beware.

So, who's the boss?... Jesus Christ; He must receive the pre-eminence in ALL things. From there, we submit to each other recognizing the gifting and ministry of Christ through each other. We cannot manifest the fullness of Christ as lone individuals, but as a Body we can grow into manifesting His fullness.

The next was a response to Doug's article:

The foundation or ELEMENTARY PARTICLES that the apostles display are the fruit of the Spirit or LOVE. There's more depth to this but that should be enough. One other thing. I appreciate what your trying to do (show what apostles really are without offending the religious order and those controlled by it's hierarchy) but in reality many are accepting apostles for GAIN and not for FREEDOM. Keep this in mind. If the FIRST or FOUNDATIONAL particles are absent the whole building is corrupt. Apostles FIRSTLY are living epistles and not FIRST bosses (a point you made very well) but to those who are part of the religious order they are FIRST meaning over or above or in authority. NOTHING WILL CHANGE THEIR HEARTS!!! As Jesus said to the pharisee "how will you escape the damnation of hell?". Pure hearts allow us to see God while those "enquiring of God through a prophet (coming to Jesus) with an idol in their heart will be answered accoring to the idol" (Ezekiel 14). We are all gravitating and hearing according to the purity of our heart motives. Nothing can change the course many are on because of the motives.

Love you brother...always good to hear you expound on the word.

In His Love

{The Gospel of the Kingdom, Changing our world through Dominion}
by Tim and Theresa Early

…Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it, and have {or take} dominion...Genesis 1:28

Welcome to chapter five of our series, as this is slightly different from the last 4 chapters.
Here we are referring to "Apostolic Destiny," where the church is headed with the apostolic dimension. Such destiny is the reclaiming of our cities, nations, and world through the dominion mandate. In this, we are overthrowing strongholds in the heavens, and over geographical territories. Here, we are declaring Jesus as Lord over all.

Section {A} The Kingdom

We have been foreknown in the mind of God, and predestined with a purpose to take the nations through Dominion, the King's Domain. We have a destination, a settlement, and an appointment with the end of this age, and the ages to come...

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world {age} to come.
Hebrews 6:5

Like John the Baptist in the Spirit of Elijah, we are a people between two eras. One is a foreclosure of events, and another we are becoming forerunners to.

In this we are not bound for disaster, or for a fatal end, but is assured to overcome...

For we are witnessing the manifested sons of God, the overcomer company, the manchild ministry, and the Melchisedec Order in today's church. This glorious church will determine the end of this age through the power of destiny. We are not sorcerers, nor are we charlatans. But, we as a present truth apostolic people of reformation, have a prophetic word in our mouths, declaring true what God has been doing all along.

We must speak it, and declare the glory of the Lord in it. We must prophesy, not only with our lips, but also with our very own lives! For we are not Generation X, but Generation {Now} and Next!

Now the destiny of the church is quite simple, " We win!" or should I say from the God-kind of perspective, "We won!" Revelation 20:10 {Victory over the Satan, the Beast, False Prophet}

Four Important Areas of the Kingdom of God

In the middle of the 80's we had put together a seminar on the Kingdom of God. The truths and topics we had developed then, became meat in due season for many. The meeting was given in four main topics, which I present to you in brief.

1- The Kingdom of God

The kingdom of God is the sphere and sovereign rule of the Lord in heaven and earth. It is wherever Jesus Christ is Lord, and is theocratic in nature. The kingdom of God is his will done in earth even as it is in heaven. The kingdom of God is pioneered through the present truth understanding that Jesus is now Lord and King! Matthew 6:10; Luke 17:20-21

And I will cut off the chariot from Ephraim, and the horse from Jerusalem, and the battle bow shall be cut off: and he shall speak peace unto the heathen: and his dominion shall be from sea even to sea, and from river even to the ends of the earth. Zech. 9:10

2 - The King of Kings

Jesus is the personification of the kingdom. Wherever he is Lord that is where the kingdom is greatly manifest. Therefore, though he is Lord over all, we must take this kingdom to the streets, cities, towns, neighborhoods, and by the Spirit of God, draw others into the kingdom of his dear son. For the purpose of the Kingdom is found in Colossians 1:13... {Also, read Colossians 1:13-19, 27}

Who has delivered us from the power of darkness, and has translated us into the kingdom of his dear son.

3 - The King-Priest Ministry

The church is the instrumentation of the kingdom, for the kingdom and church is an inseparable oneness of purpose with a dynamic and electrifying destiny ahead of us. Hebrews 5:2, 6, 10; 6:20; 7:1-28; 8:1-13; 1 Pet. 2:9; Rev. 1:5-6; 5:10; Daniel 7:22, 27

Every age or span of time has had its kingdom instrument, Even so, the church is a living entity and creative force which flows out of the last Adam, the quickening spirit.

The church must minister to creation from a throne perspective {Mercy-Seat; between the Cherubim}..."God of Israel, that dwells between the cherubim..." Is. 37:16

Thus, the church's destiny is clearly seen from the church's purpose...Dominion

4 - Practical Kingdom to Ultimate Kingdom {Mt. 5-7}

This is the kingdom on an everyday practical level. It is the kingdom in the school system, the kingdom in the home, the kingdom on the job, and the kingdom established abroad.

Ultimate kingdom is the full intent of God's will and purpose established in the earth through the church, his kingdom instrument. Practical kingdom leads to ultimate kingdom. Little changes here and there in society through reconstruction and reformation, becomes significant strides in the long run. It's here a little, there a little! {Isaiah 28:13}

The Purpose and Motive of the Kingdom

Daniel 2:44...to break in pieces and consume all other kingdoms...
1 Corinthians 15:24-26; Revelation 11:15; Hebrews 12:27-28 Daniel 7:1...For all nations to serve it...
Micah 5:2; Isaiah 9:7; Psalms 24:7-10; Isaiah 2:2; Micah 4:1-3 Daniel 7:27...Given to God's people...Other nations and kingdoms shall obey it...
Matthew 11:12; Hebrews 12:22; Matthew 21:43; 1 Peter 2:9; Romans 14:17;

We have been called out to go into...Matthew 28:18-20; Colossians 1:13...Called out of Darkness, into the Light: to go into Darkness, to bring others into the Light.
And the light shines in darkness, and the darkness comprehended {to take eagerly, seize, posses} it not. John 1:5 {John 3:19 - Ephesians 4:9-10}

Because the church world had become bombarded with passive doctrines and ideologies, a great mass of believers gave up on the dominion mandate {Kingdom Authority}. Instead of enduring tribulation and difficult times, many assume that the revelation of destiny and dominion is so elusive, that one would have to change their entire doctrinal and religious thinking to even grasp a fragment of the restored truth of the King's Domain. For some, dominion is ultra-nebula, exotic, and way, way, out! {Well, maybe it is way out of reach from the idolatry of carnal mind}

Beloved, we are given in the earth to witness some dramatic and radical changes through the presence of the Holy Spirit, and the administration of Christ's Kingdom subduing all other kingdoms as confirmed in 1 Corinthians 15:24-26, and Revelation 11:15. We are here to bring pure kingdom release to those in bondage, futility, and corruption.

..For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy {loosen, break, dissolve, melt, put off} he works of the devil. 1 John 3:8

For the earnest expectation of the creature {creation} wait for the manifestation of the sons of God. Romans 8:19 {Manifested sons of God} {also, verses 21-27}

Now, it is not to by our human strength or merit, but by the living word of the Lord and his quickening nature to stir the church for such a time as this. At his command, he is the one whom brings to pass his ultimate and sovereign will in the earth, and he is the one whom will bring to an end the injustices of our society through a people prepared for him. For in this very hour, the clock is ticking "Kingdom, Dominion, Rule, Reign, and Lordship!" This too, is accomplished through the understanding of the certain sound in our spiritual hearing. John 10:4-5; 1 Corinthians 14:7-8; 15:52; Num. 10:1-10; Rev. 1:10

..But the people that know their God shall be strong, and do exploits. Daniel 11:32

The Motive of the Kingdom

The motive of the Kingdom is always the Father's steadfast love. In John 3:16, we find this verse pivotal to the relevant truth that God does not condemn anyone, but has the ultimate end in mind to restore all men unto him self. For God so loved, that he gave, and love is never love all by itself. Therefore, true love {God-kind of love} must be shared... Now love is a person, and that love is the Lord Jesus Christ himself personified in the book of 1 Corinthians the 13th chapter. Beloved, this is the motive of the kingdom. If you were to ask any believer to take inventory of their life measured by the Personification of Love, which is the Lord Jesus Christ, what do you suppose their response would be? But then on the other hand, put this principle to work for you right now, and ask the Holy Spirit to mold and reshape you into the character of God which is his never ending and undying love, love unfeigned...Genuine love..


The church's thinking is gradually being steered into the principles of the kingdom of God to rule and reign right here, and right now. From ruling and reigning in our spirit, soul, and body, our families, and jobs, to taking the kingdom of the living God to the streets of our nations, this will be a definite concern to the church of the Lord Jesus Christ. According to Isaiah 9:7 as referenced below...

Of the INCREASE of his GOVERNMENT and PEACE there shall be NO END, upon the THRONE of David, and upon his KINGDOM, to ORDER it, and to ESTABLISH it with JUDGMENT and with JUSTICE, from henceforth even forever. The ZEAL of the Lord of hosts will PERFORM this.

The rule and reign of the Lord among the earth, is God's governmental order. It is his government versus that of this world. It is his good pleasure, his way of doing things. So, let us rejoice in the truth that the increase of his government reshapes the world we live in, and subdues it with ultimate kingdom, and ultimate purpose. For by having a world -view of the kingdom in the earth realm, we shall see a world harvest and revival of the glorious kind. We shall witness reformation on many levels.

Tim and Theresa Early
Foundation of the Apostles and Prophets School of Ministry International

"Nadab and Abihu were out of coordination with Aaron, hence they were out of coordination with God. They should not have left Aaron and served independently. Those who violate authority would be consumed by fire from before God. And though Aaron was not conscious of the seriousness of this matter, Moses realized how serious it was to rebel against God's authority. Today many are trying to serve God independently. They have never been under authority; they unwittingly sin against God's authority."

Following Jesus
Mon, 15 May 2000 17:49:59 -0400
Gary L Rose (by way of David Kolbinsky )

Dear Dave & Karen

Here is an article you should enjoy, by Dennis Kinlaw, in JUBILEE, a monthly of Prison Fellowship, I believe:

"We in the Body of Christ have made a great mistake. Somehow we have thought that God could save the world at no great cost to Himself. After all, we think, can He not speak in power and glory and redeem us?

If He can, He did not! Salvation did not come to us from God's throne; it came to us from His cross.

It seems there is a law so universally binding that not even God can make Himself an exception to it: Nothing is ultimately redemptive but self-sacrifice; Not even God saves by power and glory. He gives us His gifts; we take them, bargain for more, then turn our backs unchanged. But when He gives Himself, liberation becomes possible for us.

When we see the nail prints in His hands and feet and the scars on his brow and side, something happens to us. we expect mortals to die for their gods; history is replete with that. But when we see God die for us, we know His love.

And if He redeems only through self-sacrifice, is there any other way for us? If we want to be instruments of His peace, must we lay down our lives?

Here 20th century evangelicals have made a mistake. Our word to the world has been, "Receive Christ." But Jesus' message was not, "Receive Me. He said, "Follow Me." Suddenly one senses a shadow - the shadow of a cross. If we follow Him, we too must go the way of self-sacrifice.

We as Christ's disciples are willing to sacrifice anything but ourselves; and for this reason the world has not yet felt the full impact of the gospel. Through His grace, we must take our hands off our lives and say, "Spend me as You will." Then we will become part of His answer to the world's needs. Then our lives will see no pain, heartache, loneliness, rejection or humiliation that does not bear eternal fruit.

The call to follow Jesus needs to be spread abroad. Through our sacrifice, others can live. It is not the strong and powerful whom God will use to change society; it is the lowly and meek. His saving instrument is not the scepter but the bruised reed.

We prefer the thought of sitting with the Lion of Judah to judge the world. Our call now, though, is to follow the Passover Lamb, Who came to be consumed so that the world could be saved. The church and the world need to see this. Who can show them?

We can be eternally effective, but only if we have some scars."

Jesus,must at all times be our leader,for he has told us that without me ye can do nothing. For David speaketh concerning him,I foresaw the Lord always before my face,for he is at my right hand that i should not be moved.Acts 2:25.Even the Pharisee's who were the authority figures,in the Lord's time,had a problem with authority,when they question our Lord in Matthew 21:23,And when he was come into the temple,the chief priests and the elders of the peole came unto him as he was teaching,and said,By what authority doest thou these things? and who gave thee (this) authority? But if it be of God,ye cannot overthrow it;lest haply ye be found even to fight against God. Acts 5:39.Those who are the called,in order to not be tripped up by the obsession,of authority, and leadership,note that many just want to be a part of something or just try to get along,basically will fall for anything,but there is a leading by the Holy Spirit,to be as those who were in the book of Acts 17:11.These were more noble than those in Thessalonica in that they receivede word with all readiness of mind,and searched the scriptures daily,whether those things were so.i truly sense the Spirit moving among us,concerning this discussion,actually at this time i am rejoicing, because questioning authority,and leadership is a subject that needs to be addressed,if one does not have a problem with it then one could possibly be lead by anyone or anything.Pray for one another brothers,and sisters,unity scares the enemy.

Jesus,our leader,and why call ye me Lord,Lord, and do not the things i say.


morning Jay-I find not only your insight but also your manner of bringing that view to others very refreshing.You lay out a subject that you know there are as many view points as there are people.You allow us to speak our minds and then you look for something that might feed you also.For you see this is your site that you have set up but yet you do not run it.True power comes from God.No one can have any power unless God gives it to them.The secret to true living power is thru the death of our flesh.As Christ is our example,His true lasting power came from His death not from His living in this world in the flesh.So if that is true then the same must be said about us for to lose this life is to gain His.True leadership comes from following.My grandpappy years ago taught me that to be a good doer you first must be a good helper.I have to take that same path in my learning of Christ.If I am your friend my goal is to see what I can do to help you not to see what you can do for me.I feel sorry that for people who want to rule.They are the ones who have set themselves to fall.His vester says "king of kings and lord of lords",not mine.It is so odd that we desire to have rule over things that do not belong to us.For God will not share His glory and His glory comes from the beginning.The one who created rules!!!A true "leader",such as Paul,knows that flesh can be blinded and only by the spirit can a man can really see.When I first found this site and felt it's spirit I was so pleased.I have found a site where once again a man was blinded to worldly things and was following a spirit I call boss.Life is to short to here for us to get caught up in the battle of leadership.God when He created Adam and Eve knew that the role of leader ship was to be there downfall.and it also will be ours unless we lead by His leadership and not lending to our own understanding.Thanks again for all of your insight and your willingness to share that with others.For some know in part and if we share our part then we shall all gain.With the love of Christ and a glad heart I say,"God"s speed". Your Brother James S.

Hi Jay;

I've resisted responding the several discussions about leadership in the Body of Christ but I cannot hold my tongue any longer. I am not a bible school graduate. I don't presume to know the scriptures like the Bereans. What I am however is a student attending Holy Spirit University. He has said many times that He will teach me, not man.

The Lord has plainly told me the following, among many other things: "I have called you to be a leader at Sheepfold (my AoG church)..." He used the word leader, not me. He also told me that I wear a banner across my chest with the phrase "Bond-servant" and He gave me Luke 22:26. I didn't ask for it - I'm as surprised as anyone else. He has also told me not to worry about man's titles, they only impress other men and not Him. I have no credentials, nor am I recognized by any denomination as being called to a Five-Fold Office. The Lord however has other plans apparently. He has clearly called me to an office and I have seen/experienced consistent increases in anointing and power as I participate in the ministry to the saved and unsaved.

I have delivered two Sunday School messages and a mid-week service last week, to everyone's surprise (including me!) After the service (titled, "Miracles") I prayed for six people, four of whom "fell out" under the power of the Holy Spirit. These are not courtesy drops and I only mention them to demonstrate that it is God who validates the calling, not man.

Whether you or I like it or not, God Himself told me that He has called me to be a "leader" in my local church and He has been providing opportunities and opening doors where, quite suddenly, I have become an integral part of the ministry team. People are recognizing what God is choosing to do through me and they are beginning to seek me out to minister to them, especially the leadership of the church (pastors, deacons). There have been undeniable outpourings of the Holy Spirit's power including miraculous healings and deliverances. In fact, each passing week finds greater and greater anointing in my walk with the Lord. It is all Him!

The Lord has also anointed me to reach out to men of a similar age as myself (thirtysomethings). I've seen awesome spiritual growth in two men in particular, in a very short time. God is raising up His Last Days Army and it has leaders commissioned by Him personally, not by man.

I intend you no insult but I must share with you what has been happening and what I have been hearing. Your only recourse is to reevaluate your thinking around this idea of leadership in the Body of Christ or dismiss what God has been saying to me, doing through me and what He has sovereignly called me to.

In Christian Love,
Brian Tanguay

God has placed more experenced Christians over us to teach us. We must be submissive to them if God has called us to be under theis athority. All throughout the bible you can see this example. Yes, Jesus is the ultimate leader, but we have human leaders God put in our life in order to teach us what we need to know. If you refuse to come under that spiritual athority, then you aren't showing a Christ-like attitude. Therefore, you aren't living for Christ like you should. We have enough vigilante Christians in the world. We don't need any more. I will admit, there are many examples out there where the leadership has went overboard. But if this is the reason why you feel that you don't have to submit to athority, you are as wrong as they are. I ask you to dig in your bible a little deeper, and you will see that God has reasons for people to submit to another. In Christ's faithful service,

Jay, I just finished reading your letter under this heading, about women in authority especially. I am really having to struggle with this issue, mainly because of what it seems to me the Lord is doing right at this hour in the earth. I agree mostly with what you have said, in that women have true author-ity from the Lord in this earth through the power of the Holy Spirit. I think the danger is when women are "over" men in a "position" of authority in the church, and please just bear with me as I explain what I mean. As far as in a place of ministry, I have to wonder at the idea of a woman being a pastor or teaching wherever there is a man who has "equal" authority from the Lord. Only because it is such an unnatural thing for men to be "submitted" to women. It seems very out of order to me. I think I have seen some terrible abuses in my life and have seen women who have assumed that position, and almost every one fell into sin, including two of the ones you mentioned. Both Amy and Kathryn were involved in extended adulterous relationships, actually going off with married men in hidden affairs. I don't say God didn't use either of them in response to His calling on their lives, or that He didn't do anything through them or that they didn't ultimately repent and allow the Lord to work through them. But I can't help but wonder if they wouldn't have been better off married to men who were true believers who would have "covered" them and protected them. It is hard for me to reconcile the whole thing, but I am really submitting this to you as food for thought.

This is a difficult issue for me, as my husband is a very macho kind of guy even though he isn't for the most part "oppressive". In ministry he has always been the one who does most of the talking at our concerts, and he is definitely the "preacher" even though I am the one that gets most of our songs, actually does the writing. It has been a little hard for me to work out things with my husband and the guy who plays music with us because they are such strong men, and they really have a hard time with me "leading" so they kind of have to take control in every situation. It at times has been a source of conflict, and I have felt like they don't really respect me because I am a woman, which has caused me some resentment. They will change my songs, tell me I'm doing things wrong, get kind of bossy a lot, which is rather unpleasant. But I have really prayed about this and felt the Lord showed me that HIS authority is not at all like the world's. It is love, and truth, and "servanthood"....that HE never sought to "rule over" any person and came to free us from such a terrible lie that has been foisted upon us by the enemy. I heard a couple from Mission America teaching on this subject, and I really witnessed to what the Lord had shown them. In Genesis, God told man that He had given him dominion over the fish of the sea, the fowl of the air, every aspect of creation. NOT over men, or even woman, that was the result of the fall of man. Jesus told His disciples that if they wanted to be greatest in the Kingdom of Heaven they must make themselves least of all. I think any woman having true "authority" from the Lord will not desire to "lord" over another person, man or woman, as any man who has true authority will also attest to. I have never seen this work in a healthier way than in my church, where we have elders and pastors who are all equal in their "power" to "direct" or to oversee the affairs of the church. But there has never been anyone there who flaunts their "power" or "postion" as one "over" as much as to simply "oversee" the flock. To protect, lead, teach and feed as a shepherd does his sheep. We have women elders and deaconesses who are elected by our congregation, they are included in the decision making of the church in areas of how things are done, money spent, etc. I have never seen a more humble man than my pastor, or a more godly man. His life speaks much louder than his words. He is in no way a showman or using the gospel as a means of getting gain for himself. He has never been involved in immorality or scandel, and neither does he condemn others who have been. But I do think there is a sound warning in scriptures for us to "look for fruit" of those who profess to know God. No matter how good the "show" may be. I have seen so much over the years. I am sure you have, too. I'm convinced more than ever that those who really love God are the most humble among us, not in any way desirous of "ruling over" or having a "position" of "power" or "influence" so much as wanting to protect, heal, lead and free those who are bound by the oppressive religious or political leaders who have abused the God-given role of true authority. I'm sure we are really saying the same thing, I guess my image of women in authority has been some very abusive, loud and "bossy", proud people who were more hurtful to the cause of Christ than helpful...I think it is one of the reasons we have so much confusion of roles, homosexuality and other very unnatural occurances. I really agree with Sister Co's prophecies, and that God is restoring HIS order to the church by raising up MEN who will LEAD as JESUS did, those men will not be threatened by any woman who is moving in the true annointing and authority that comes from the HOLY SPIRIT (the dove has neither claw nor sting nor weapon for the fight)...but I do believe every woman needs to be "covered" by men, either a pastor or a husband who is releasing her, not out there establishing her own "ministry"....these are my true and deepest concerns and I just wanted to share them with you.....In His love, Karen

Excerpt from Tim Early

Another example of roots and fruits has to do with the Headship and Preeminence of Christ. For we are not only the body of Christ, but Christ the body. Everything in the Christ is to be found in his body. Unfortunately, we have substituted our Lord's headship for denominations which are birthed out of carnality as confirmed in 1 Corinthians 1:10-13; 3:1-4. Denominationalism and sectarianism finds its root strength in human numbers, the same sin King David committed as found in 1 Chronicles 21. Such sin was the result of many lost lives, for to depend on numbers is to depend on the human merit and strength of others. It is simply finding your worth, value, and esteem in the strength of frail flesh. Also, in regards to denominationalism, and non-denominational denominationalism {get it}, the core values and belief factors are of utmost concern. For a group can argue over tenets of doctrine, pitch their tent, later to turn it into a monument. For a monument is where God was, but a divine movement of the Spirit is where God the Father now is

Colossians 2:10, 19; Ephesians 1:22-23; 4:3-6, 15

Tim and Theresa Early
Foundation of the Apostles and Prophets
School of Ministry International

What if Leaders Got Hungry? - by Pastor Alcorn
24 May 2000 02:56:45 -0000
"Trumpet Wind Ministries Prophetic Email List"

May 23, 2000

Inspiration and Information from Pastor Jana Alcorn and various leadership resources to assist today's Christian servant in the Move of God!

Proverbs 15:22 NIV -- Plans fail for lack of counsel, but with many advisers they succeed.


Leader, it is not enough to know the "how-to's" of ministry. We must be be passionate for His Presence. We must make room for Him; in fact, so much room that there is no longer any room for us. I'd like to provoke you with a question.



As leaders, our chief ministry is to the Lord. In Acts 13:2, the Holy Spirit spoke only AFTER they had ministered unto Him.

"As they ministered to the Lord and fasted....the Holy Ghost said."


I'm sorry, leader, but we can't offer God our sermons. Anyway, we are not just to speak about the Lord, but to speak FOR Him! How can you do this without first taking in Him as the source of our strength!

Everything the "services need" will be the outflow of our feasting upon Him.

John 6:57 -- As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.


Someone can just talk about chocolate and I want it! Leader, what if our hunger provoked the Body of Christ into seeking the Bread of Life! Can you imagine how this would stir our churches and our ministries? Just the smell of something baking makes me want it! How much more does the actual substance of it within my reach!

Matthew 5:6 -- Blessed are they which do hunger.....for they shall be filled!


When we understand that we are not after sermons, but we are after HIM, then and only then, will our hunger began to be God-directed, instead of performance directed!

We may forget sermons, but we do not forget encounters with Him!

When he comes forward, we fall backward.

John 18:6-- As soon as he had said unto them, I am he, they went backward, and fell to the ground.


When David got hungry, he went against protocol. He actually went for the shewbread (bread of His face.) He did not just look at it; he partook of it. But not only did David eat, they that were with him ate also.

Luke 6:3,4 -- And Jesus answering them said, Have ye not read so much as this, what David did, when himself was an hungered, and they which were with him; How he went into the house of God, and did take and eat the showbread, and gave also to them that were with him;

We have created atmospheres for man, but where is the one that will create the atmosphere for HIM? What IF leaders got hungry......


Re 5:12-13 "Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive Power, and Riches, and Wisdom, and Strength, and Honour, and Glory, and Blessing. And every creature which is in Heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and Honour, and Glory, and Power, be unto Him that sitteth upon The Throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever."

If His will is to be done in earth as it is in Heaven, then our worship must be intense and we must be given to the Worship of the Lord continually.


I not only use all the brains that I have, but all that I can borrow.

The well-run ministry is not a battlefield of egos.

Good leadership consists of showing average people how to do the work of superior people.

The new leader is a facilitator, not an order giver.

Leadership is action, not position.

If you do not know where you are going, every road will get you nowhere.

It takes more than an anointed sermon to lead the people of God.

Excellence is not an accomplishment. It is a spirit, a never-ending process.


I am calling you to go on. There are some things that must be severed and some that must be added. Some of this will happen as part of this process and you will not have to be directly involved. Other things, you will be a part of.

It is time to move into My vision for the House. No longer will you be bound by other's expectations, but you will move to meet Me, says the Lord. Deal with this in a different way for relationships change, says the Lord.

Let My processes take effect. Allow it to happen. The move will bring My favor and the heavens will be open unto you. No longer will you be held back by the invisible shields that have been over you, but you will approach Me in clarity and you will hear Me in clarity and you will have the confidence of knowing My will. This is not haughtiness, says the Lord, but overwhelming confidence that you know Me and that you have heard My voice.

So now, follow, says the Lord and I will be with you!

the newsletter from antithesis
05.07.00 -- biblical leadership

In the first century, no Christian would dare take the position or title of sole ruler, overseer, or pastor of the church. We Christians today, however, are so accustomed to speaking of "the pastor" that we do not stop to realize that the New Testament does not.

There is only one flock and one Pastor (John 10: 16)
one body and one Head (Col. 1: 18)
one holy priesthood and one great High Priest (Heb. 4:14ff.)
one brotherhood and one Elder Brother (Rom. 8:29)
one building and one Cornerstone (I Peter 2:5ff.)
one Mediator, one Lord.
Jesus Christ is Senior Pastor,
and all others are His undershepherds (1 Peter 5:4).

alexander strauch, biblical eldership

If we have the worldıs mentality of wanting the foremost place, we are not qualified for Christian leadership. This mentality can lift us into ecclesiastical leadership or fit us for being a big name among men, but it unfits us for real spiritual leadership.

To the extent that we want power we are in the flesh, and the Holy Spirit has no part in us. Christ put a towel around Himself and washed His disciplesı feet (John 13:4). We should ask ourselves from time to time, "Whose feet am I washing?"

francis schaeffer, doing the Lord's work in the Lord's way

And they love the place of honor at banquets,
and the chief seats in the synagogues,
and respectful greetings in the market places,
and being called by men, Rabbi ["Teacher"].

But do not be called Rabbi
for One is your Teacher,
and you are all brothers

jesus, in the gospel according to matthew, chapter 23


Biblical Leadership

In complete obedience to Christ's teaching on humility and brotherhood, the first Christians and their leaders resisted special titles, sacred clothes, chief seats, and lordly terminology to describe their community leaders. When establishing churches, Paul never ordained a priest or cleric to perform the church's ministry. When he established a church, he left behind a council of elders chosen from among the believers to jointly oversee the local community (Acts 14:23; Titus 1:5).

Obviously that was all he felt a local church needed. Since the local congregation was composed of saints, priests, and Spirit empowered servants, and since Christ was present with each congregation in the person of the Holy Spirit, none of the traditional religious trappings such as sacred sites, sacred buildings, or sacred personnel (priests, clerics, or holy men) were needed. Nor could such be tolerated. To meet the need for community leadership and protection, Paul provided the non clerical, elder structure of government -- a form of government that would not demean the Lordship of Christ over His people or the glorious status of a priestly, saintly, body of people in which every member ministered.


The New Testament provides a consistent example of shared leadership as the ideal structure of leadership in a congregation where love, humility, and servanthood are paramount. When it functions properly, shared leadership requires a greater exercise of humble servanthood than does unitary leadership. In order for an eldership to operate effectively, the elders must show mutual regard for one another, submit themselves one to another, patiently wait upon one another, genuinely consider one another's interests and perspectives, and defer to one another. Eldership, then, enhances brotherly love, humility, mutuality, patience, and loving interdependence -- qualities that are to mark the servant church.


I believe that churches today desperately need a revival of love, humility, and the servant spirit.

Such a revival must begin with our leaders, and biblical eldership provides the structure through which leaders learn to work together in mutual love and humility.

Since the eldership represents a microcosm of the whole church, it provides a living model of loving relationships and servanthood for the whole body. Thus, leadership by a plurality of elders ideally suits the humble-servant church.

--Alexander Strauch, from Biblical Eldership http://www.discerningreader.com/books/0936083115.html


Since the New Testament plainly sets forth a leadership structure, why don't we simply follow it? In my recent conversation with Jack Crabtree, we noted that there seems to be an Evangelical "disconnect" between the confessed stand on Biblical authority and how the Christian faith is actually practiced. This comes into sharp focus when we ask, "How ought we structure our Christian fellowships?" As Alexander Strauch demonstrates, the Bible's teaching is quite plain. (But you have to actually READ the Bible -- not just give lip-service to it!)


Senior Pastor needed for Bible based Church. Impressive and charismatic leader needed to oversee every detail of the church. Will provide most, if not all, teaching. Will hand pick staff of assistant pastors as well as board of elders. Should people in the church disagree with his leadership, they are free to leave.


setting things in order an urgent call to restore biblical leadership alexander strauch

For many people, the issue of church government (also referred to as church polity, church structure, church organization, church order, or the ministry) is as irrelevant an issue as the color of the church pews. Indeed, for many people the color of the church pews inspires greater interest! To these people, the organizational structure of the church really doesn't matter. The average church member's disinterest in how the church is governed needs to be challenged, however. Church government is an extremely practical and theologically significant issue. So I ask those of you who have not thought much about this subject, or have assumed that it is unimportant, to consider the following points.

Some of the worst havoc wrought to the Christian faith has been a direct result of unscriptural forms of church structure. Only a few centuries after the apostles' death, for example, Christian churches began to assimilate both Roman and Jewish concepts of status, power, and priesthood. As a result, church government was clericalized and sacralized. Under Christ's name an elaborately structured institution emerged that corrupted the simple, family structure of the apostolic churches, robbed God's people of their lofty position and ministry in Christ, and exchanged Christ's supremacy over His people for the supremacy of the institutional church. Furthermore, church organizational structure matters because structure determines how people think and act. Ultimately, structure determines how things are done in the local church. I find it ironic that some evangelical leaders in America are more concerned about the structure of the United States government than the structure of the local church. I doubt that many evangelical leaders would say, "It doesn't matter how the U.S. government is structured as long as there is some form of leadership." Yet, that is precisely what I have heard some evangelical leaders say about the local church

Jay, While in my quiet closet the other night, the Lord has allowed me to write this. I am not a prophet, and don't claim to be one. But I am highly interested in the unity and forward motion of His Church. The word is out in the world that the Apostles/apostolic people/movement is and has been around, AND is making its present mark on the Church to prepare it for Him. There is too much time being spent on talking about the Apostles and their means and ways, and no time in "just doing it". There is too much time/talk spent on trying to discern and learn and point and discredit, etc. Jesus says to let the tares grow with the wheat until the harvest. We are not the reapers. We are to water and plant ONLY. Our Lord reserves that for Himself. Yes, we are to unify, correct, rebuke, set in order, teach, lead, build, tear down. Nowhere in the Word does it say for us to be the harvesters. Let the Apostles do what they are called to do and let's not put them in a box or bind them up into religious structures. Smith Wigglesworth would probably be in an insane asylum today for his methods, as well as many others. Yes, we must be careful of false doctrine of apostles not called, but they end up revealing themselves and condemned by their own words anyway. If the Apostle or Prophet is not received by a denomination or local Body, so be it. They have their reward. Much of the stuff written today on Apostles is repetitive and contradictory from one writer to the next. This is not a good beginning for this office to be released in the Church. There are many who have been operating in this office for 10 years and are not "officially" recognized by many denominations. So what? Eventually they will. The work of the Lord is being done. The Church is growing. It is a fact that the original 12 did not operate the same way. There are different administrations, etc. This has really been heavy in my Spirit lately. The more I read, the more I foresee more squabbling over who is right. Let the Lord separate the wheat from the tares.
Thanks Jay. Correction/Comments welcome.
love in Jesus, Joseph

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